Balance or Imbalance

Falconer_Joanna

Astellian
Sep 28, 2019
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101
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Looking for Opinions of other archer's here. Do you try to balance Physical Accuracy and Critical Attack Accuracy? Is there a minimum number you maintain? For example I normally try to keep both over 1k and put the rest into Critical Attack. However I've been noticing that I don't get mostly get critical hits on the bosses in T2 dungeons. I don't miss any noticeable amount, thus I wonder if it would be better to keep Physical Accuracy closer to 950 and raise critical accuracy to 1100. Obviously we all want critical attack as high as possible.

Normally there is a break even point where if you're doing at least 50% critical hits, then your damage is maximized. Since we don't know exactly how hits are calculated, it's hard for us to maximize our damage. So we have to use trial and error. Looking to see what other Archers have found to be their best setups.
 

Falconer_Joanna

Astellian
Sep 28, 2019
155
101
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Thanks for the input Panda. your and my observations seem to match. I guess the question is how much critical accuracy should we have? 1k, 1.1k, 1.2k how much is enough so we can put the rest into critical attack. That's the rub.
 

Pandalicious

Astellian
May 31, 2019
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393
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Thanks for the input Panda. your and my observations seem to match. I guess the question is how much critical accuracy should we have? 1k, 1.1k, 1.2k how much is enough so we can put the rest into critical attack. That's the rub.
I went 8 crit dmg runes 7 crit acc. On Hawk I have like 1.5k Crit Acc and similar amount of Crit dmg.
 

Kobe

Astellian
Jan 25, 2020
250
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Physical Accuracy decreases your chances of missing normal attacks.
Critical Accuracy decreases your chances of missing Critical attacks.

Since we always want to Crit, we want to pump Crit Acc. up as much as possible, and not worry about Phys Acc. since it's a secondary stat for us.

Not sure how much for Ranger, but on Hawkeye I'm 1.5k Crit Dmg. and 1.3k Crit Acc. and I get way too many non crits.
I think the goal would be similar to Panda's stats at 1.5k each, but you would need to have GG gear, all leg runes and close to 30% AGI rolls.
Crit Acc. runes are extremely rare on NA so not much I can do to improve.
 

Falconer_Joanna

Astellian
Sep 28, 2019
155
101
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Without The bonus that the Hawkeye gets, I don't think the Ranger can approach those numbers. I run 1238 AGI and can't get near 1500 Crit Accuracy as a Ranger. Besides the only way to really push it higher for me is to lower Crit Attack, so I'm not sure that's the path to take. What are your Crit Accuracy numbers like as Ranger? It seems like 1100 isn't enough to T2 dungeons.
 

Kobe

Astellian
Jan 25, 2020
250
179
43
Yeah I'm not even sure 1.5k Crit Acc. is possible to be honest, even with perfect gear. Might need to ask Panda to post a screenshot to show us she's legit 😉 The only reason we can even reach 1.5k Crit Attk is because of the two Crowns, so I'm not sure how she can reach 1.5k Crit Acc. without bonuses from Treasures. I think 1.4k is a more realistic goal.

As for Ranger stats I don't remember but it was ugly. I prefer big numbers that's why I stick with Hawkeye 😀
 

Falconer_Joanna

Astellian
Sep 28, 2019
155
101
43
The thing I like about ranger is the defensive bonus. While I have +10 Armor and Weapon for Hawkeye, I'm not quite ready to throw in the towel on the ranger as I still like that defensive bonus for solo work. Why solo in an MMO? Well sometimes you don't have time to get a group together and wait for everyone to 'ready up' and you just want to do something quickly in game.

I think Panda's in the right track with shooting for 1k physical attack. It seems to make misses few and far between. Next if we look at the pop-up's when we mouse over our stats; Evasion - 'Increase the chance of evading physical/magical attacks' While Critical Evasion - 'Reduce the chance of taking a critical hit from physical/magical attacks'. Ignoring Astellia's long history of imprecise wording, what this seems to imply to me is that you first have to pass a check to see whether your attack hits. Once a hit is obtained, Critical Accuracy (which ironically in called Critical rate in the Auction house) is compared to Critical evasion to determine whether the hit is a critical attack or a normal attack.

It follows that you want Critical accuracy as high as possible, once Accuracy is high enough to ensure hits. Indeed, I have kept Accuracy above 1k, and have pushed Critical Accuracy above 1.2K an the results have been very promising. Against the 70k mobs in avalon, I'm obtaining a nearly 10:1 ration of critical hits to normal hits. Times through solo dungeons are similar if not somewhat shorter. I am certain I can get Critical Accuracy over 1.3k and a very tempted to do that, but that would drop critical attack below 1k. I might have to settle for around 1.25k Critical Accuracy and 1k critical attack.

Of course those numbers could easily be achieved on a Hawkeye, and I have little doubt Panda can reach them. Her gear is better than mine, though make no mistake, mine is very good considering I play on NA, where legendary runes are super rare, and AGI based Necklaces and Earrings almost unheard of (at least the ones I need for T3).

I find it very surprising that nobody else is experimenting with this, but will continue to post my observations in the hopes that some find it useful.
 

Pandalicious

Astellian
May 31, 2019
781
393
63
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Interesting but yet unrelated side note: I made a 2nd ranger. The gear is full AGI/CON with attackrunes and energy. 1.2k AGI but somehow only 800 accuracy. I dont understand why but the build itself is d i s g u s t i n g.
 

Falconer_Joanna

Astellian
Sep 28, 2019
155
101
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AGI and DEX effect Physical Accuracy the same amount, so you're not getting your usual boost from DEX maybe? I would try to use Physical Accuracy runes to get my accuracy above 1k.

I'm running a ratio of 9:6 for Critical Accuracy to Critical attack. 4 of the 6 Critical attack runes are legendary and only 1 of the critical Accuracy runes is legendary. I can easily keep Critical attack above 1k and can add another 7% to that when I get a second Crown. That means I can run a 10 :5 ratio and that should break the 1.3k barrier. Is that enough? Is 1250 enough? that can only be answered by more t2 dungeon runs or the Devs actually releasing the calculations used (I won't be holding my breath waiting for that.....). What this has impressed upon me is that Critical Accuracy appears more important than Critical Attack.
 
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Aang

Astellian
Sep 18, 2019
114
61
28
Agi: acc and crit acc
Dex: acc and crit Attack

Dex and agi give the same amount of acc
 

Kobe

Astellian
Jan 25, 2020
250
179
43
The thing I like about ranger is the defensive bonus. While I have +10 Armor and Weapon for Hawkeye, I'm not quite ready to throw in the towel on the ranger as I still like that defensive bonus for solo work. Why solo in an MMO? Well sometimes you don't have time to get a group together and wait for everyone to 'ready up' and you just want to do something quickly in game.
If it's just for PvE then I don't understand why you would need defensive stats at all, since if we're partying then we have tank+healer and if we solo we have Astels to do those jobs for us, which gives us the ability to do a full glass-cannon build for PvE.

I think Panda's in the right track with shooting for 1k physical attack. It seems to make misses few and far between. Next if we look at the pop-up's when we mouse over our stats; Evasion - 'Increase the chance of evading physical/magical attacks' While Critical Evasion - 'Reduce the chance of taking a critical hit from physical/magical attacks'. Ignoring Astellia's long history of imprecise wording, what this seems to imply to me is that you first have to pass a check to see whether your attack hits. Once a hit is obtained, Critical Accuracy (which ironically in called Critical rate in the Auction house) is compared to Critical evasion to determine whether the hit is a critical attack or a normal attack.
For Hawkeye we already have 1k Phys. Acc. (with eagle eyes buff) ) without having to slot any Phys Acc. runes, especially since we get Phys. Acc. from both AGI & DEX.

But you make a very good point about a normal hit check and then a critical hit check. It would be interesting to test this with a really low number of Phys. Acc. to see if this is true or not. For eg. if it was possible to have 0 Phys. Acc. and say 2000 Crit. Rate - Can we still Crit or even Hit anything at all?

I find it very surprising that nobody else is experimenting with this, but will continue to post my observations in the hopes that some find it useful.
I would say that's mainly due to the lack of a combat log and damage meter. It would be very hard to determine which build yields more damage other than anecdotal evidence which doesn't really prove much.
 

Kobe

Astellian
Jan 25, 2020
250
179
43
What this has impressed upon me is that Critical Accuracy appears more important than Critical Attack.
And this is the very reason why Archers prioritize AGI over DEX. Crits in this game are way too big compared to normal hits so we always want more Crit. Acc. Furthermore, Crit. Attk. is much easier to increase (Crowns and runes) than Crit. Rate.
There is of course a breakpoint where you would have TOO Much Crit rate and not enough Crit Dmg. For eg. if you go a full AGI build you might crit all the time, but your crits would be puny due to the lack of DEX.
 

Kobe

Astellian
Jan 25, 2020
250
179
43
Interesting but yet unrelated side note: I made a 2nd ranger. The gear is full AGI/CON with attackrunes and energy. 1.2k AGI but somehow only 800 accuracy. I dont understand why but the build itself is d i s g u s t i n g.
Going tanky might be good for PvP but without DEX you will hit like a girl 😂
 

Falconer_Joanna

Astellian
Sep 28, 2019
155
101
43
If it's just for PvE then I don't understand why you would need defensive stats at all, since if we're partying then we have tank+healer and if we solo we have Astels to do those jobs for us, which gives us the ability to do a full glass-cannon build for PvE.
I find a full Status Effectiveness build to take a lot of damage, even with 11k HP, you can't dodge any boss AOE's without evasion so you have to keep moving which reduces your number of attacks. Also with full SE build, you have to use sniper or it's not worth it. But having to cancel sniper to move defeats this purpose. Dodging meteor in Library or the Lightning attacks in Basin is hard enough w/o throwing sniper in the mix.

I would say that's mainly due to the lack of a combat log and damage meter. It would be very hard to determine which build yields more damage other than anecdotal evidence which doesn't really prove much.
Actually what I've found effective is to use a knight astel to hold aggro then do just normal attacks on the mobs on the plague side of tulie. You can count the number of hits and critical hits fairly easily. The mobs on the plague side get a defensive bonus so tend to be a bit harder. You could also do the same in Avalon with the 70k mobs there.. While this doesn't exactly show how you would do against t2 bosses (which is really what this discussion is about) it shows there is a break even point.

DEX giving acc would be new to me. I thought DEX only gives Crit Acc
If you look at: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1shDC43HOcSzCrw6wTtRDRiCOboxV7TS5SeUkWfsQ7MQ/edit#gid=1618782825

He/She does a good job breaking it down there. Also if you look at note 1, I believe his theory #4 is the correct one.
 

Kobe

Astellian
Jan 25, 2020
250
179
43
I find a full Status Effectiveness build to take a lot of damage, even with 11k HP, you can't dodge any boss AOE's without evasion so you have to keep moving which reduces your number of attacks. Also with full SE build, you have to use sniper or it's not worth it. But having to cancel sniper to move defeats this purpose. Dodging meteor in Library or the Lightning attacks in Basin is hard enough w/o throwing sniper in the mix.
For harder bosses such as the first boss in Library then of course you don't activate Sniper, but for many of the bosses there are always windows of opportunities to use Sniper. Knowing when, and when not to use Sniper is a skill in itself. If you ever get caught out in Sniper mode and need to move ASAP, just cancel it or use Rush.

Besides, going Evasion on Hawkeye is just a waste, so it's either HP or SE. Going HP allows you to play more relaxed I guess, but if you want more damage then go SE with HP food buff still gives you enough HP to survive any encounter currently in the game.

If you look at: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1shDC43HOcSzCrw6wTtRDRiCOboxV7TS5SeUkWfsQ7MQ/edit#gid=1618782825

He/She does a good job breaking it down there. Also if you look at note 1, I believe his theory #4 is the correct one.
Out of those four theories, only Theory 2 suggests that Phys. Acc. helps with Critical hits, so I think it's pretty safe to never slot any Phys. Acc. runes.