Current Ranger Thoughts

Falconer_Joanna

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Sep 28, 2019
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It's one thing to nerf certain skills to better balance the game, while disagreeable, it's at least understandable. It's quite another thing to completely change the playstyle of a certain class without any warning, thus invalidating months of your player's time. This is the current status of the Ranger. I have tried to make the 'revised' class work - it just doesn't. If it had a bonus to Energy and evasion it would make far more sense, but alas it doesn't. For anyone considering trying this class, I offer simple advice:

Do not waste your time or experience trying the Ranger advanced class, it is absolutely no fun to play, at best it's a steaming pile.

Lets look at the bonuses: Critical Attack and Evasion. With bonuses like this you would think, you hit hard and can hang in there and avoid attacks. However once you try its skills you quickly find it can do neither. Only one of your awakened skills is a mobile skill - Rush - enabling you to quickly run away from any opponent, trust me you'll need to do this. In fact, this skill is grossly out of place with the rest of the Ranger's skills, they obviously couldn't think of a final skill for the 'new' Ranger.

Looking at the rest of your awakened skills, you would think you need to stack damage over time (DOT). However since you get NO bonus to energy, your DOT value is far less than the Bounty Hunter, and is thus a pathetic addition to your arsenal. Additionally you will constantly find yourself spamming Regenerate Mana in any fight that lasts more than 2 cycles as your awakened skills are fairly mana intensive. How bad are your awakened skills? Well real archers have only 1 skill that has a cast time, yet your awakened skills actually double that number. None of them have any stopping power and with the huge nerf to evasive arrow, can expect to just be rooted in one spot, or running around performing many basic attacks.

I know what you're thinking. Just switch to Hawkeye and play as that. Sadly that doesn't work. With it's bonus to evasion, it makes sense to stack AGI and DEX in a ranger - playing to its strengths. Since a Hawkeye gets no defensive bonus, CON plays a far more important role and should be a prominent part of any setup. Of course finding equipment in the Auction House on the NA server is a pipe dream. I can expect to spend many months searching for equipment that simply isn't garbage - never mind finding its T2 counterpart with stats that I can accept, oh and lets not forget all the stones and stelite I'll would need to perfect it. I expect to have to spend a year or two to make a Hawkeye that is equivalent to the Ranger I've been spending the last 7 months working on. Besides who's to say the Devs won't just change their minds on a whim and completely invalidate all my efforts on a 'new' Hawkeye.

Hopefully BG3 comes out before my premium time ends......


I have crossed that out because with the May update, the Ranger has become very playable. Admittedly, it's different than other Archers and is certainly PvE focused, but i is a very playable advanced class if you prefer PvE. It really has only one valuable bonus, Evasion. The bonuses to Critical Evasion and Status Evasion while nice, don't impact play as much as your evasion bonus does. While the bounty hunter beats the Ranger in Crowd Control, the addition of Eagle Strike means you won't be that far behind. Besides the Ranger does excel on single target DPS. The skills the ranger gets (besides Eagle Strike and Rush) all work very well against any single target. Having Bleeds and Burns going simultaneously is the norm for any creature you don't kill outright. Often you can switch targets, knowing that your first is going to burn/bleed to death, with most of their attacks missing you with your high evasion. Finally the buffs to rush effectively make it a 7 second window where you can drop aggro AND take no damage (it nearly doubles your evasion). I'll admit for any T1 boss, I probably move out of their AOE attack about 1/2 the time, the rest of the time I rely on evasion to help me avoid damage. Besides if you take a big hit, activate Rush, then Vitality and you've gained back a huge amount of health. So if you want to focus on PvE and like the archer play style - look no further than the Ranger.
 
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Pandalicious

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May 31, 2019
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My thoughts on Archer: awesome, flexible, clearly defined roles, BH still a meme
Ranger now is extremely powerful in PvE IF played correctly and still good in PvP.
Hawkeye can still play a decent PvE and is straight up broken,inba,busted in PvP.
Playing both on AGI/DEX here. I see the occasional CON/STR on my gear as a semi failstat. You dont need this. AGI DEX is the way. I can still reach 1.5k Evasion on Hawkeye ez, just as a ranger I had a straight 1.7k when ready to rumble. Trust me, people still aint hittinh a lot on 1.5k evasion. Also, as a Hawkeye you have the non awakened rush which, hold on tight, gives a straight boost of around 1.3k Evasion, Crit Evasion and Status Evasion. Combine in with Links smokescreen or a Sins Smokescreen and you stand there with 6k+ laughin at the enemies .
Pre-Updated Rangers were straight up even more broken in PvP than Hawkeye is now, even without that non awakened Rush (the eva goes away when you awaken it).

I play since Day1 of CBT 1 and had a legendary headstart also gaining one of the Forerunner titles (top 20 fastest lv50 for each subclass). I have over 1k hours of pure playtime on my Archer (not couting the plenty of afk farm hours). Trust me, I know what I am talking about.
 
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Falconer_Joanna

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Sep 28, 2019
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My thoughts on Archer: awesome, flexible, clearly defined roles, BH still a meme
Ranger now is extremely powerful in PvE IF played correctly and still good in PvP.
Hawkeye can still play a decent PvE and is straight up broken,inba,busted in PvP
Interesting, I was talking about Rangers, and you're talking about Archers. I think the Hawkeye is fine, and the BH excels are taking out trash (not that there's value in that, but whatever).

I get it, you have absolutely no idea how to actually build a character and make your equipment actually match your role, so of course you think the world is fine. You couldn't possibly see the difference between nerfing a character and changing it. You enjoy playing with sub-optimal setups....I pity you.
 
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Pandalicious

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Mate I think YOU are the one that has no clue of this game. Stacking CON makes no sense because guess what? Your base stat on this is so incredibly low all the % on your gear is the biggest waste in the history of MMORPGs. Imagine trying to stack HP on a Archer. Omegalul. My guilds (not Codex)in past games would have kicked you for that

You just cry because your, or in that case our, certainly broken subclass got nerfed and you fail to accept it.

Or you are just a horribly bad player. Could also be. Who knows.

Oh and about "making gear match your role": Building a tank stat aka CON on a DD CLASS is quite the opposite sweetheart.
 
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Falconer_Joanna

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Sep 28, 2019
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You just cry because your, or in that case our, certainly broken subclass got nerfed and you fail to accept it.
I suspect English isn't your first language since you can understand what I wrote or you're misreading it. Let me explain it for you:

I am not upset the ranger got nerfed, nerfing a character to balance it will never be popular, but is understandable. I'm upset because it got changed, it was PvP focused, now it is PvE focused. Had they nerfed it, but left it PvP focused it would be a lot easier to accept. Many people are voicing the same opinion, what upset them most, wasn't really the nerf, it was the change in focus.

If they allowed us to change our weapon and armor, I would go Hawkeye in a moment never change back. I would change an accessory or two, and my runes and be fully setup in a few weeks. I never said I would stack CON, obviously any Archer should prioritize AGI, but without the evasion bonus, CON's importance approaches that of DEX, if not slightly more so. Sure I could make a AGI/DEX build work as a Hawkeye. I could re-balance the runes, but still have to change the Armor and Weapon. So now if I want to enjoy the game, I need to change my t2 bow and my t2 armor, my defensive runes and an accessory or two. That will take months, and simply put isn't worth it. I'm not going to use a Ranger Bow and Ranger armor as a Hawkeye. I just checked, there is exactly 1 armor and 0 weapons that I would consider buying, that leaves me looking for another armor and 2 weapons. I have the Accessories to change my ring, and the workings to change either my earrings and/or necklace - but those seem much harder to find than bracelets.

I see you think it's ok to just swap to Hawkeye when you want to PvP and then swap to Ranger for PvE. Do you use the same equipment for both? Do you not see the inefficiency in that? If not, what do you change? Do you think everyone has two sets of equipment laying around, two sets of runes? If you can't understand that changing the focus of an advanced class, is completely different than just nerfing it, then, as I said earlier, I really do pity you.
 

buismor

Astellian
Aug 5, 2019
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I suspect English isn't your first language since you can understand what I wrote or you're misreading it. Let me explain it for you:

I am not upset the ranger got nerfed, nerfing a character to balance it will never be popular, but is understandable. I'm upset because it got changed, it was PvP focused, now it is PvE focused. Had they nerfed it, but left it PvP focused it would be a lot easier to accept. Many people are voicing the same opinion, what upset them most, wasn't really the nerf, it was the change in focus.

If they allowed us to change our weapon and armor, I would go Hawkeye in a moment never change back. I would change an accessory or two, and my runes and be fully setup in a few weeks. I never said I would stack CON, obviously any Archer should prioritize AGI, but without the evasion bonus, CON's importance approaches that of DEX, if not slightly more so. Sure I could make a AGI/DEX build work as a Hawkeye. I could re-balance the runes, but still have to change the Armor and Weapon. So now if I want to enjoy the game, I need to change my t2 bow and my t2 armor, my defensive runes and an accessory or two. That will take months, and simply put isn't worth it. I'm not going to use a Ranger Bow and Ranger armor as a Hawkeye. I just checked, there is exactly 1 armor and 0 weapons that I would consider buying, that leaves me looking for another armor and 2 weapons. I have the Accessories to change my ring, and the workings to change either my earrings and/or necklace - but those seem much harder to find than bracelets.

I see you think it's ok to just swap to Hawkeye when you want to PvP and then swap to Ranger for PvE. Do you use the same equipment for both? Do you not see the inefficiency in that? If not, what do you change? Do you think everyone has two sets of equipment laying around, two sets of runes? If you can't understand that changing the focus of an advanced class, is completely different than just nerfing it, then, as I said earlier, I really do pity you.

What he forgot to mention was that he has 2 non-perfect gear sets, 1 for Hawkeye and 1 for Ranger, so he has no clue how people with PERFECT t2 gear before the patch (even with 1 gear set only) feel when they are now forced to change (This applies to Assassins as well)
 

Pandalicious

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May 31, 2019
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What he forgot to mention was that he has 2 non-perfect gear sets, 1 for Hawkeye and 1 for Ranger, so he has no clue how people with PERFECT t2 gear before the patch (even with 1 gear set only) feel when they are now forced to change (This applies to Assassins as well)
Did you just assume my gender? My gear is more perfect than 99% of the people will ever have ;) My +10 Necklace has one of its AGI stats on 79.4, which is the highest stat I have ever seen. (I know it can go up to 80, but I never ever saw it)

I was just more clever than other people having played enough mmorpgs to know that in every game classes/subclasses get changed sooner or later.
 

Pandalicious

Astellian
May 31, 2019
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I see you think it's ok to just swap to Hawkeye when you want to PvP and then swap to Ranger for PvE. Do you use the same equipment for both? Do you not see the inefficiency in that? If not, what do you change? Do you think everyone has two sets of equipment laying around, two sets of runes? If you can't understand that changing the focus of an advanced class, is completely different than just nerfing it, then, as I said earlier, I really do pity you.
A lot of mimimi. I get it that you cant accept that you have to use other subclass to do PvP now. And no, I do not use the same gear. As I already mentioned, I do have 2 gear sets. I change my complete gear and runes, skills, Astels, everything - even treasures - when I swap from PvE Ranger to PvP Hawkeye. And for the love of god they need to sell inventory expansions or a mobile storage access. Would pay 50€ for that.
 

Falconer_Joanna

Astellian
Sep 28, 2019
161
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Did you just assume my gender? My gear is more perfect than 99% of the people will ever have ;) My +10 Necklace has one of its AGI stats on 79.4, which is the highest stat I have ever seen. (I know it can go up to 80, but I never ever saw it)
My +10 Necklace has the following Stats:

AGI - 72.7
AGI - 80.3
Dex - 71.0

Now you've seen it.

I change my complete gear and runes, skills, Astels, everything - even treasures - when I swap from PvE Ranger to PvP Hawkeye. And for the love of god they need to sell inventory expansions or a mobile storage access. Would pay 50€ for that.
Still working on Collecting another armor and 2 weapons. I had been working on a second complete set of runes for a while, and will change my Earrings eventually (the other stuff I can work with). As I said earlier, I'd like to see your setups - or at least what you're working on. The Hawkeye is fairly straight forward, but it almost seems as if using some Energy runes for the Ranger might be worth it as stacking DOTs is pretty easy. I can understand if you don't want to post you thoughts here, so feel free to do it in a private conversation.
 

Falconer_Joanna

Astellian
Sep 28, 2019
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Figured someone would ask, now let me ask you why do you think I would make this up? What value could I possibly gain?

ScreenShot00010.jpg
 

Falconer_Joanna

Astellian
Sep 28, 2019
161
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I have no idea, I just know what I got. I don't even remember which item had it and what it was originally - that was a long time ago.


Thoughts (and suspicions) on the 5/26 patch

First off I am glad the Devs have given us a heads-up on the upcoming changes. More communication is always appreciated.

First lets look at the positives:
    • For Ranger’s Awakened Skill, “Barbed Arrow”, the cooldown will decrease from 17 to 3 seconds.
    • Bleed duration and damage in Ranger’s Awakened Skill, “Barbed Arrow” will increase.
    • Burn duration will increase to 30 seconds for Ranger’s Awakened Skill, “Blast Arrow”, and the longer the target is in Burn status, the greater the damage will become.
    • For Ranger’s Awakened Skill, “Rush”, the cooldown will decrease from 60 to 50 seconds, and the skill will increase Evasion, Critical Evasion, and Status Evasion as a bonus.
So they'll be able to have a continuous Bleed and Burn going, the Bleed will do more damage and the burn will increase in damage over time. These are fairly substantial buffs, or at least they will need to be, because lets look at the nerf:

Ranger: (Current) Critical Attack, Evasion → (Changed) Evasion, Critical Evasion, Status Evasion

The loss of critical attack bonus is a very, very large nerf. I say this because if you look at your damage over time for either a bleed or burn, you will notice two different numbers tick off one of which is around 4 to 6 times larger than the other. The smaller number is the value of the bleed or burn hitting for normal damage, the larger number is the bleed or burn hitting for critical damage. So your critical damage multiplier effects your 'instant damage' AND your 'damage over time'.

Don't believe me, simple test, get a bleed or burn going (use blast arrow is easiest), watch the damage numbers tick off. Now do it again and change your critical attack value (add or remove runes) on the same type creature. You'll see the smaller value won't change, but the larger value will. All you changed was your critical attack multiplier.

Since this is the case, ever since the 4/28 patch, the ranger's damage was increased, and the ranger was turned into the defacto PvE archer subclass (at least for single target damage). A simple equation for this is:

Total Damage = (Instant Damage + Damage over time)

The buffs we're getting will raise Damage over time, however the nerf to critical attack reduces BOTH Instant Damage AND Damage over time. Thus the buffs have to be substantial or overall damage will be lower. Now some would argue that depending on the scaling of the burn damage, we could eventually surpass our current damage. While that is possible, it had better scale very rapidly or it won't matter, for example why would anyone care if damage after 10 minutes surpasses our current damage capability if no NPC lasts that long? Lets face it, the hardest T2 bosses need to be reduced quickly, the longer it takes the more likely it is for players to run into mana/heal problems and/or miss one AOE dodge and lose the battle. If they make the Ranger take a much longer time to apply the same (or less damage), then it's probably best to not bring one along on any dungeon run.

I believe balance between the classes should be based on PvP. I don't care if any character can one shot any boss in any dungeon, as long as that character is balanced for PvP. So turning the ranger into the defacto PvE archer, then nerfing it doesn't seem like a good use of Dev time, but that's hardly my call.

So while I would like to see how this all works out, and I hope those people who stay rangers like the changes, I'm less than optimistic about these changes. But lets see how this all plays out.
 

Falconer_Joanna

Astellian
Sep 28, 2019
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Thought I would add this for any thinking of trying rangers now. The buffs to blast arrow and barb arrow were very large. For blast arrow, DOT damage is up by close to a factor of 9, while bleeds are up by around a factor of 7. Additionally, they actually raised the evasion buff on the ranger. While I ranger has limited stopping power, npc's will have a very hard time hitting you and if you use rush, your evasion nearly doubles. It's a 7 second window where you effectively take no damage (for example my evasion goes from around 1400 to 2760).

Blast arrow is basically a death sentence for any non-boss, with 30+ seconds of burn damage (depending on skill points applied). With a 3 second cooldown, you'll have a constant bleed. Fights might last a bit longer, but you can easily use far less mana as you watch a target bleed and burn to death. I often find myself, hitting a burn then just switching targets as the first has no chance, then just calmly wiping out the second. If you find your self taking too much damage, tap rush and heal while you can't be touched. Other rangers and I believe your overall damage has actually increased. The class has completely changed, and requires a different playstyle, but works very well.
 
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