[POLL] Avalon Changes

Which Change Should We Make?

  • 1) Keep the current setting

    Votes: 28 23.9%
  • 2) Change to 1 hour PvE and 3 hours PvP

    Votes: 56 47.9%
  • 3) Change to 2 hour PvE and 2 hours PvP

    Votes: 33 28.2%

  • Total voters
    117
  • Poll closed .

Ignitus

Astellian
Feb 1, 2020
6
2
3
Whatever. It's pretty sad when even your old guild members agree with me. Only reason most people were there was because it was an easy win, take that away or make people actually have to work and you'll start to see their true colors. A lot of this is coming from your own guild members...msging me telling me how much of cowards you guys are and how they hate the way you guys represent them. Many people.

But whatever...say what you want. I won't be back. You know the truth though. :cool:

Changing the subject to flame more …. Lets actually get back to meaningful stuff like the neglect that the Avalon treasures are clearly not working as I believe they were intended.
 

Kreese

Astellian
Oct 11, 2019
1
0
1
Heyas Shawtie,

Last week was a calculated risk we took the barrier stones early, given the numbers Physe players we were going to loose if we didn't take their base. We would never have taken the stones that early otherwise as it puts you at the time lock disadvantage you witnessed in the closing day.
So, we pushed their base the day before, but they were able to summon enough defenders during there off time to push us out of their base. At this point it was basically over. It was just AFTER we failed to take the base that someone put the premature congrats in all chat. Given that we had effectively just lost, it was strange and I have to wonder due to the timing what the persons motives for posting that were

Anyway, I am glad to see you guys pushing this week looks like you have a good chance

Ky
 

Diversion

Astellian
Jun 30, 2019
19
11
3
Well if you wanna pk ppl that are naked while they quest i understand the concern about not liking pve time, but for that you can enlarge your attributes in 1v1 arena if you like (generic reference), avalon is supposed to be a cooperative area to reach objectives, so giving the fact the active population is ridicolous over the scale of avalon map, if you don't force ppl to fight at specific time for atra stone, you will never find any pvp or zerg or whatever you like to get involved into, 3h of pvp is exactly like not havin any pve time, is way too dispersive over the daytime, and treasures atleast compensate the fact that some class is braindead over some other class, so in a zerg they help a lot to don't get insta erased or perma disabled by some random mage BS skill, i see ppl complain coz they can't kill a party alone like they were used to do before, sry but not my problem :)
 
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Terra

Astellian
Sep 20, 2019
1,039
566
113
i just thought about what you wrote ... and would like to throw in another suggestion based on that

1) open avalon "normal" pvp 24/7 [so that the pvp'ers can pvp to their hearts content]
2) create an "opt-out" possibility for players, who do not wish to participate within this pvp [for example in a non hostile friendly faction]

3) redesign half of the atra stones into events [reward : time-limited cosmetics/titles] two or three times a day [while leaving the others as is]

that would basically open up the possibility, for players to actually "gather together" during the event times ... without restricting the pvp for pvp interested players and without the need for pvp'ers to stomp onto pve'ers (if you create a fair pve-faction that is)
 
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Legolasa

Astellian
Dec 3, 2019
15
18
3
i just thought about what you wrote ... and would like to throw in another suggestion based on that

1) open avalon "normal" pvp 24/7 [so that the pvp'ers can pvp to their hearts content]
2) create an "opt-out" possibility for players, who do not wish to participate within this pvp [for example in a non hostile friendly faction]

3) redesign half of the atra stones into events [reward : time-limited cosmetics/titles] two or three times a day [while leaving the others as is]

that would basically open up the possibility, for players to actually "gather together" during the event times ... without restricting the pvp for pvp interested players and without the need for pvp'ers to stomp onto pve'ers (if you create a fair pve-faction that is)
I'm 100% with you on whatever you want to implement and if you don't want to participate in the PvP I understand that. but I am playing Pve and Pvp so it is only logical that I get rewarded more than the pure Pve player since I am putting more work into 2 types of playstyle. Agree ?
 
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Legolasa

Astellian
Dec 3, 2019
15
18
3
Make Avalon Great Again --------> #MAGA
Weeklies can be taken by all factions every week without the need to cap stones
Capping stones gives extra Points in pve or pvp
强烈建议24小时PVP 强烈建议24小时PVP 强烈建议24小时PVP

MAGA forever
 

Terra

Astellian
Sep 20, 2019
1,039
566
113
I'm 100% with you on whatever you want to implement and if you don't want to participate in the PvP I understand that. but I am playing Pve and Pvp so it is only logical that I get rewarded more than the pure Pve player since I am putting more work into 2 types of playstyle. Agree ?
i do agree with you on the point, that someone who invests 10 hours a day should get a higher reward, than someone who only plays 5 hours ... though, a soft cap [the more you got, the higher the bar for your next reward gets] would be a good thing there, to prevent too large/fast powergaps

however, pve and pvp gameplay simply is too different from each other, to be directly compared with each other

if you have to prepere a five course menu ...
can you realy say, if the starter, salad, soup and the desert-cake is more or less work than the main dish ?


can you realy say, if someone who spends his 8 hours workday on baking a cake in the bakery works "harder" than someone spends his 8 hours cooking the meals in a restaurant ?

i'd say that highly depends on the individual situation ... on the WHAT you actually make ...

it's different, yes ... but to generalize that this or that is harder ... i don't think that you realy can do that

and the same it is within this game,
pve and pvp simply are too different to be directly compared with each other

you can't realy say "running around 1 hour in avalon is more work, than doing one hour library runs" ...

and even if you realy could, it would depend on the situation ...

killing an ungeared heroic-geared newcommer with full T2+10 isn't exactly harder than a ruthlass run
killing a zerg of 10 T2+10 players singlehandadly while wearing heroic gear on the other hand should be way harder than finishing a library run ...


which is why you can't say "this" or "that" is harder / more afford / more work ... they are different, yes ... but in no way is one harder than the other

the one doing his 10 hours pvp should be able to earn the same ammount of zender as the one doing his 10 hours of pve
[maybe even "implement" these "how hard is it" factor somehow into it ... new ungeared player killed ... low points ... finished low lvl pve ... low points]

and the one splitting his playtime, afford, work between pvp and pve ... the one playing 5 and 5 ... of course, he should be able to earn the same ammount than the one who plays purely the one or the other for his 10 hours


scale it pimraraly with the time consumption, something needs to be acchieved on one hand
and with the "hardness" [x% of the participating community is able to acchieve the goal] of something on the other hand

but equal afford and timeconsumption should lead to similar rewards ... regardless of what type of gameplay you choose to play
 

Legolasa

Astellian
Dec 3, 2019
15
18
3
i do agree with you on the point, that someone who invests 10 hours a day should get a higher reward, than someone who only plays 5 hours ... though, a soft cap [the more you got, the higher the bar for your next reward gets] would be a good thing there, to prevent too large/fast powergaps

however, pve and pvp gameplay simply is too different from each other, to be directly compared with each other

if you have to prepere a five course menu ...
can you realy say, if the starter, salad, soup and the desert-cake is more or less work than the main dish ?


can you realy say, if someone who spends his 8 hours workday on baking a cake in the bakery works "harder" than someone spends his 8 hours cooking the meals in a restaurant ?

i'd say that highly depends on the individual situation ... on the WHAT you actually make ...

it's different, yes ... but to generalize that this or that is harder ... i don't think that you realy can do that

and the same it is within this game,
pve and pvp simply are too different to be directly compared with each other

you can't realy say "running around 1 hour in avalon is more work, than doing one hour library runs" ...

and even if you realy could, it would depend on the situation ...

killing an ungeared heroic-geared newcommer with full T2+10 isn't exactly harder than a ruthlass run
killing a zerg of 10 T2+10 players singlehandadly while wearing heroic gear on the other hand should be way harder than finishing a library run ...


which is why you can't say "this" or "that" is harder / more afford / more work ... they are different, yes ... but in no way is one harder than the other

the one doing his 10 hours pvp should be able to earn the same ammount of zender as the one doing his 10 hours of pve
[maybe even "implement" these "how hard is it" factor somehow into it ... new ungeared player killed ... low points ... finished low lvl pve ... low points]

and the one splitting his playtime, afford, work between pvp and pve ... the one playing 5 and 5 ... of course, he should be able to earn the same ammount than the one who plays purely the one or the other for his 10 hours


scale it pimraraly with the time consumption, something needs to be acchieved on one hand
and with the "hardness" [x% of the participating community is able to acchieve the goal] of something on the other hand

but equal afford and timeconsumption should lead to similar rewards ... regardless of what type of gameplay you choose to play
You are completely missing the point ! I should be rewarded more than you because I am Baking in the bakery and cooking in the restaurant ! i'm doing 1 more job more than you, you are just cooking in the bakery. so after saying that I believe you should not get the rewards of cooking in the restaurant. and no you cant reward the baker the same reward as the chef, it all depends on the market what they want. they both have different rewards.
 

Terra

Astellian
Sep 20, 2019
1,039
566
113
You are completely missing the point ! I should be rewarded more than you because I am Baking in the bakery and cooking in the restaurant !
if you cook part-time 4 hours in a restaurant you get the salery of 4 hours in the restaurant
if you cook full-time 8 hours in a restaurant you get the salery of 8 hours in the restaurant

if you cook part-time 4 hours in the bakery you get the salery of 4 hours bakery
if you cook full-time 8 hours in the bakery you get the salery of 8 hours bakery

and if you cook 4 hours in the bakery and 4 hours in the restaurant you get the salery of ?
a) the restaurant + x%, becouse your bakery skill influences, how well you can make a salad
b) the bacery + x%, becouse the knowledge of soup-making influences, how well the cake will taste
c) the salery of 4 hours restaurant and 4 hours bakery

choose your answer ...

also, i don't know how it is where you live ...
but (at least here) even the tax gets calculated from your combined income

you don't "work more" ... you don't "work harder",

you just have two part-time jobs instead of one full-time job


and yes, youre 100% right, it depends on the market ... what the salery is

so what is the market for astellia ?
the pvp crowd ? ... the pve crowd ? or maybe the game needs both of them in it's current state and can't afford to loose either of these two ?
 

Legolasa

Astellian
Dec 3, 2019
15
18
3
if you cook part-time 4 hours in a restaurant you get the salery of 4 hours in the restaurant
if you cook full-time 8 hours in a restaurant you get the salery of 8 hours in the restaurant

if you cook part-time 4 hours in the bakery you get the salery of 4 hours bakery
if you cook full-time 8 hours in the bakery you get the salery of 8 hours bakery

and if you cook 4 hours in the bakery and 4 hours in the restaurant you get the salery of ?
a) the restaurant + x%, becouse your bakery skill influences, how well you can make a salad
b) the bacery + x%, becouse the knowledge of soup-making influences, how well the cake will taste
c) the salery of 4 hours restaurant and 4 hours bakery

choose your answer ...

also, i don't know how it is where you live ...
but (at least here) even the tax gets calculated from your combined income

you don't "work more" ... you don't "work harder",

you just have two part-time jobs instead of one full-time job


and yes, youre 100% right, it depends on the market ... what the salery is

so what is the market for astellia ?
the pvp crowd ? ... the pve crowd ? or maybe the game needs both of them in it's current state and can't afford to loose either of these two ?
you think I work 2 part time, but im more efficient than you in PVE, for you haveli is for example 20 min and I do it in 10 min , 5 haveli per day for you is 1h 40 min and for me is 50 min, and I do PVP in that remaining time, I run with you previous dungeons and when I told you to pull all the mobs you said maybe I want to take my time and enjoy. well you can't complain later why I get paid more than you when I get 2 jobs 4 hours bakery 4 hours pvp, because in the 8 hours you are baking I am doing 4 hours baking and we get same result. so on top of you I am making cooking an extra 4 hours. So you see where I am better ? its Efficiency
 

Terra

Astellian
Sep 20, 2019
1,039
566
113
well, to begin with, it's usually the tank who pulls the mobs
the only times i remember running groups without a tank with you where crimson and lagash with pure dd's ...
and that runs where actually rather fast ones

[ please correct me, if i should be wrong there ... becouse that discussion actually happened quite a long while ago already ],

what we where discussing was the high time-limits of dungeons and how easy it would be, to acchieve an S-rank
we than switched over to the point, that the quality of drops isn't realy influenced by the time someone needs to clear a dungeon ...
that the asper you get at the end would depend on the rank but not the itemquality / droprate

that led you to the argument, that it wouldn't even matter, if someone is heroic geared or full T2-geared
since they could finish the dungeons anyway ... they have the high time-limit and the dungeons are clearable with full heroic ... it may just take a little while longer

and i answered you, that this little while longer - in and on itself - already would be a pretty huge benefit [if you look at it long-therm]
(and yep, the discussion was shifted to the usual topics of rng already at that point)

[side note, becouse it fits into the topic : rng and rng effects (like upping an item in a whoop to +10 ... or getting stuck 4/5 of your avalon time in the same faction, while others could buguse their weekly twice a week etc) should not be falsely mistaken as "efficiancy"

or to stay at your bakery ...
you could have bad luck and someone puts it on flames ... or good luck and get a millionair spending you the newest equipment

sure, the one without kitchen will be less efficiant, than the one with kitchen
but that's neiter his honer nor his fault ... it's not even his responsibility

of course, the good 5-star cook can still try to get the meals done in time ...
but it will be quite a lot harder for him, to do so

it's just good or bad luck ... and that has exactly nothing to do with efficiency ...

and in the end of that (rather long) discussion,
we ended up agreeing that thus some/many players within this game simply don't realy care about the time needed for the dungeons and some players don't like stressfull speedruns, but rather prefer to take their time and enjoy the dungeons once in a while

in that whole discussion i don't remember me talking about myself even a single time ...
but like i said, that discussion was already a long while ago ... so i could be wrong there too

also, everything you mentioned above would be pretty much included within my idea

if you do 1 run of S+ Tier content A, you could than use your remaining time, to do another S+ tier content B
if someone takes twice the time than you, to clear content A, he will either have to spend more time, to get another content (and thus the same rewards) done ... or he wouldn't get the reward

that in and on itself is ok

but that has to be done in a fair way

you can't simply go out there and say
"so, and now the player cleared S+ content A ... becouse he now does S+ content B, which is pvp and thus harder, he gets more rewards than the one who does the S+ pve content C instead"

that would be wrong

of course it makes sense, to differantiate between different difficulty lvls within a certain gameplay element
the ruthlass run is easier, than the library run
clearing library in 50 min is easier, than clearing it in 10 min

killing an heroic equiped new player, while wearing T2+10 yourself is easer,
than killing a raid of T2+10 players, while wearing heroic yourself

so it makes sense, to asigne "difficulty levels" to the certain tasks ...
but these rankings have to be determined in a fair way according to the gameplay element, they're within

and not according to the question if pve or pvp gameplay is harder ...
and not according to the question, if someone who spends his time playing pve "works" more than someone who spends his time playing pvp or someone, who mixes both of these together during his playtime

becouse they're simply too different, to be directly compared with each other

also, some kind of soft cap [the more you already got within a certain time, the higher the bar gets raised for your next step] would make sense

[i rewrote the text, to make it better understandable]
 
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