So much RNG and less Astel progressing

mystykz

Astellian
Sep 30, 2019
85
71
18
And the game like it is now is not appealing to majority of users hence it's slightly dying state of withering down. Wether People like it or not you gotta please the casual crowd not the vocal minority of hardcorers with all the time in the world.
And for the Crowd stuff like the Ticketsystem and RNG are indeed in a dire need of overhauling.

Can't even help anyone who doesn't wanna do the same dungeon you need/want out BECAUSE of the ticketsystem totally killing the aspect of the MMO genre which is PLAYING TOGETHER WITH OTHERS as with current Ticketsystem you have like a inner circle so rip any other guildie/random that doesn't wanna do e.g. say Prison legendary as you wouldn't use your Tickets for other things than that due to their limited nature. If one can't see the issue in that one can't be helped.

And that is just one example.
 
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Zwiebel

Astellian
Jul 4, 2019
409
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And the game like it is now is not appealing to majority of users hence it's slightly dying state of withering down. Wether People like it or not you gotta please the casual crowd not the vocal minority of hardcorers with all the time in the world.
And for the Crowd stuff like the Ticketsystem and RNG are indeed in a dire need of overhauling.

Can't even help anyone who doesn't wanna do the same dungeon you need/want out BECAUSE of the ticketsystem totally killing the aspect of the MMO genre which is PLAYING TOGETHER WITH OTHERS as with current Ticketsystem you have like a inner circle so rip any other guildie/random that doesn't wanna do e.g. say Prison legendary as you wouldn't use your Tickets for other things than that due to their limited nature. If one can't see the issue in that one can't be helped.

And that is just one example.
And yet you are pretty much the only one complaining about it while the majority is having fun with the game...

On one side you advocate for a casual friendly game and on the other you advocate for removing the ticket system which would directly benefit hardcore players with a lot of spare time and not casuals with limited playtime per day that can barely even deplete their existing tickets.

Seriously, pick a side. You cant have it both ways.


For the love of god, why cant people see the bigger picture here?
Removing the ticket system would require a total rebalancing of loot drops and rewards in dungeons.
Currently, dungeons are ridicolously effective in grinding xp and asper. Removing tickets from the game would completely wreck the game balance as everyone would spam dungeons 24/7 and never take a step in the outside world again. Then Astellia converts into some kind of glorified lobby game like Wow. And Im sure nobody wants that.

Btw, i never had problems helping other players. I dont mind losing a few tickets for running a lowlevel dungeon because I still get xp, loot and Astel drops even though its not as much.
If you have issues with helping people if you have to sacrifice something for it, maybe helping people is not your thing anyway. Because when I help friends, that is my reward in itself and I dont need extrinsic motivation to do that.
 
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mystykz

Astellian
Sep 30, 2019
85
71
18
Scroll through the discord and i mean scroll back when PEOPLE ACTUALLY PLAYED before they left, discord was 24/7 full with bad rng; bad ticketsystem; bad stats 24/7; bad lootdrops etc posts; have fun scrolling through 2 months of discord but we both know you won't because then you'd see that your little bubble pretending everything is fine with the game and nothing is there to improve would be bursted. Same on the forums actually,just search RNG and you ll find dozens of topics e.g. Now is obviously only people left that don't mind the way things are because People who have been bothered by said things left already ages ago as not everybody is naive enough to believe that the devs can polish the game in the right direction in time and not everybody is patient enough for that either so they gone and playing things that is worth their time and fun.
 
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Zwiebel

Astellian
Jul 4, 2019
409
328
63
Scroll through the discord and i mean scroll back when PEOPLE ACTUALLY PLAYED before they left, discord was 24/7 full with bad rng; bad ticketsystem; bad stats 24/7; bad lootdrops etc posts; have fun scrolling through 2 months of discord but we both know you won't because then you'd see that your little bubble pretending everything is fine with the game and nothing is there to improve would be bursted. Same on the forums actually,just search RNG and you ll find dozens of topics e.g. Now is obviously only people left that don't mind the way things are because People who have been bothered by said things left already ages ago as not everybody is naive enough to believe that the devs can polish the game in the right direction in time and not everybody is patient enough for that either so they gone and playing things that is worth their time and fun.
Most of these Threads are coming from the very vocal minority in this thread, including you.
Why should I bother about discord? All I care about are the people playing the game.
Because those are the ones supporting it financially.
 
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mystykz

Astellian
Sep 30, 2019
85
71
18
Enjoy living in your cute little Bubble where everyone who ain't sharing your point of View is vocal minority and then doesn't even inform himself either doing the research in forums/discord to see what's wrong and you ain't worth the time to prove you wrong by listing all people said. Atleast devs ain't as narrowminded. Enjoy living in a bubble hiding from the truth all time. Peace out.
 

Zwiebel

Astellian
Jul 4, 2019
409
328
63
Enjoy living in your cute little Bubble where everyone who ain't sharing your point of View is vocal minority and then doesn't even inform himself either doing the research in forums/discord to see what's wrong and you ain't worth the time to prove you wrong by listing all people said. Atleast devs ain't as narrowminded. Enjoy living in a bubble hiding from the truth all time. Peace out.
I presented you with actual arguments you never responded to and instead went directly for ad hominem and somehow I am the narrow-minded? Way to go.
 

mystykz

Astellian
Sep 30, 2019
85
71
18
On one side you advocate for a casual friendly game and on the other you advocate for removing the ticket system which would directly benefit hardcore players with a lot of spare time and not casuals with limited playtime per day that can barely even deplete their existing tickets.

Seriously, pick a side. You cant have it both ways.


For the love of god, why cant people see the bigger picture here?
Removing the ticket system would require a total rebalancing of loot drops and rewards in dungeons.
Currently, dungeons are ridicolously effective in grinding xp and asper. Removing tickets from the game would completely wreck the game balance as everyone would spam dungeons 24/7 and never take a step in the outside world again. Then Astellia converts into some kind of glorified lobby game like Wow. And Im sure nobody wants that.
Yea sorry didn't see the sneaky edit after i posted my things on your post!
No one said anything about removing as that would need complete recoding, changing it to 1 Ticket per Dungeon,making a Quest available to replenish Tickets,letting Tickets stockpile to more than 20 so somebody who can't play during the week but has all the time on the weekend to go through even 100s etc there is lotsa creative ways to make it less restrictive towards progress as most of your progress is the dungeons which yet are limited as can be and then always drop wrong stats.
My Storage with 15 Legendaries all being a trainwreck like full mage stats on melee or meleestats on mage/scholar are saying hi. Only reason i keep them is for the unlikely case they see reason and add something akin to farmable stat reroll tokens eventually.

Leg Dungeon give like 80k i wouldn't call that effective given you can run 3 boosted 5 non boosted a day atm. So 400k of that and 100k of Dailies is half a Mil out of 90mil. Other than those all you have left is hashukal farming once all party/amiequests are done. God save thy minds doing that daily. Gotta wait for December and see how the new Zone turns out with Dailies there.

With Ticketsystem being adjusted the game would actually be more ALIVE contrary to your believe as momentarily is the case that most people just use their tickets for their own gain which is understandable so partyfinder takes forever if your guildies/friends are offline. While with Ticketsystem slightly eased more people wouldn't mind doing random dungeons, and doing dungeons with randoms as they know they have more than enough so dungeonfinder is way more active.

Nothing is wrong with WoW per se. It made MMORPGs widely available to most people. Are there better options nowadays than it. Sure. It is a pioneer though and it still is okay nowadays. Fair enough BFA was...well..ehm...yes...but it literally just feels like a Bridgeexpansion leading up to Shadowlands being the good stuff. WoW always kinda goes bad good bad good expansion somehow :x
 
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Zwiebel

Astellian
Jul 4, 2019
409
328
63
.
Leg Dungeon give like 80k i wouldn't call that effective given you can run 3 boosted 5 non boosted a day atm.
Leg dungeons are not effective in terms of asper or xp per hour. Thats the point. The people running them do so for legendaries and treasures.

Normal group dungeons with their easy to kill mobs grant way better xp per hour and asper aswell as everything dies so quickly.

The reason why people do not spam normal group dungeons for this reason is that they are not cost effective as they spend the same amount of tickets in them.

You see the problem here: if you release ticket restrictions the cost effectiveness becomes irrelevant, causing players to spam easy farmable dungeons very quickly to accumulate obscene amounts of asper and xp. Tickets do a great job at giving players the choice between running dungeons that are time effective or running dungeons that are cost effective.
 

Jazices

Astellian
Nov 10, 2019
35
34
18
Just in this topic alone I count 10+ish people who share the same view of too much rng and limitations of astels/tickets vs only 2 one of them being you mr.zwiebel that are fine/against it. Similar in all other topics related to those things. Even in discord today alone people were talking how stupid the fact is that Avalon treasures can break if you aren’t rngblessed. So short version: sorry to bring it to you but YOU are the clear minority and everything mystykz said is true and relevant and the game needs changing to appeal AND keep people which limitations and Las Vegas Style rng in everything doesn’t do.
 

Trox

Astellian
May 24, 2019
379
223
43
Just in this topic alone I count 10+ish people who share the same view of too much rng and limitations of astels/tickets vs only 2 one of them being you mr.zwiebel that are fine/against it. Similar in all other topics related to those things. Even in discord today alone people were talking how stupid the fact is that Avalon treasures can break if you aren’t rngblessed. So short version: sorry to bring it to you but YOU are the clear minority and everything mystykz said is true and relevant and the game needs changing to appeal AND keep people which limitations and Las Vegas Style rng in everything doesn’t do.
Thats because it is a known fact (as in indisbutable truth) that a very small minority of gamers visit the forums on the regular, and most of those are only the ones with a complaint about the game. The majority of the time people that are happy with the way the game is going will not bother visiting the forums.
 

Jazices

Astellian
Nov 10, 2019
35
34
18
People who come to the forums/discord are actually the ones which are the most passionate about it and want the game to succeed. But then out of those there is 2 kinds the ones which live in their own little world pretending everything is fine and perfect without issues and the ones who are real and see that the game needs to have some more changes to be a viable contender in the western market and if it doesn’t make it more appealing for the western audience then it will not succeed which would be a shame as the game is great outside the always mentioned game mechanics everyone mentions which are leftovers from p2w Version still.
 

Trox

Astellian
May 24, 2019
379
223
43
People who come to the forums/discord are actually the ones which are the most passionate about it and want the game to succeed. But then out of those there is 2 kinds the ones which live in their own little world pretending everything is fine and perfect without issues and the ones who are real and see that the game needs to have some more changes to be a viable contender in the western market and if it doesn’t make it more appealing for the western audience then it will not succeed which would be a shame as the game is great outside the always mentioned game mechanics everyone mentions which are leftovers from p2w Version still.
Except noone is saying the game isn't without issues; we just don't want it to be come another easy mode MMO that hands you full BiS in a weeks time which is what is seems a lot of those that "want the game to be a viable contender in the western market" even though the second they cave to those guys the game will become a failure as everyone maxes out in a week gets bored and leaves.......with those that whined for the change usually being the first to bail.
 

Zellata

Astellian
Aug 3, 2019
215
104
43
Thats because it is a known fact (as in indisbutable truth) that a very small minority of gamers visit the forums on the regular, and most of those are only the ones with a complaint about the game. The majority of the time people that are happy with the way the game is going will not bother visiting the forums.
That's actually only half-truth. It's a known fact that small minority goes to forums (usually approximated at about 10% of the playerbase), but there's absolutely no correlation between forum-goers and players with complaints. Actually, in our case the number of folks with complaints is probably close to 100%, given how many little things are still broken. Not necessarily complaints about RNG, but other things like bad translation, bugged AH search, quests that send you to the wrong NPC, not all classes being gender-unlocked, etc.

Oh, and part about "BiS in weeks" is an outright lie. Not that it would be such a bad setup - it would merely make Astellia more PvP-centric, but that's not what people are asking for to the best of my knowledge. At least I can't think of anybody here who is pushing that particular idea.
 
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Flet

Astellian
Oct 11, 2019
42
12
8
You're missing the point. Yes, in a very long term everybody will get every astel to 10 stars (assuming that the game survives that long - it will take a LOT of time). However in a shorter term, let's say 3 to 6 months, that won't happen, and some of your astels will have more stars than others. Now, let's say that I want "passionate" deck effect for PvP for example (just off top of my head) - if I get lucky and have 7 star Canceria, I am golden...if I am not so lucky and have 7 star Kukuma instead, I am screwed.
Given that you can now only obtain 1-3 star im not sure there will even be that much disparity within that time scale. All my astells are raising fairly evenly. The ones that are in the boxes im getting are all within 1 star of each other, my guardians are all within 1 star of each other.

Before the change it was possible for people to get lucky a few times in a row and have that be a significant advantage, but i just dont think the math for this works anymore since the change. I doubt its possible to be more than a star ahead or behind the average of what ever other astells are within the same group as the one you are farming (once you are past the first few stars that is).


Diablo is more cooperative than competitive. In our case those people would only stay happy until they got steamrolled in PvP by someone
See thats the thing, im not convinced this would result in steamrolling. Ive been looking at the korean versions avalon rankings. The site is pretty nice because you can look at the rankings and also look at the characters and their equipment. Now that version is far ahead of us across the board, and idneed the people on absolute top tend to have more or less perfecet equipment, but just below the absolute top there is a bit of diversity in gear and stat spreads that leads me to think having perfect gear or even 'near' perfect is not really that relevant. There might be a noticable difference between a person with nothing good and a person with everything good, but once you get into the realm of 'decent' you tend to see it not really mattering that much.


Maybe BDO, but folks seem to like it because of cool scenery more than treating it as any sort of competitive environment.
See thats the thing, i played BDO, i absolutely hated it because its tedious and annoying RNG, im just not feeling it here. Thats why im saying this games RNG is more of a middle ground due to all the potential layered advancement mechanisms, whereas BDO is far more about just trying to + equipment and playing its stupid failstack system.

Everybody does HG dailies around the same time with only one channel - doesn't seem to be an issue. As for community, I have to disagree with you here - there's a reason "open world" style MMOs are practically extinct, and got replaced by "theme park" style. Most people passionately hate that whole "wonder around looking for a spot" business and would much rather have content available on-demand.
Most people have never experienced that kind of game, since most mmo players started with and have only played certain kinds of WoW clones. The last, lets say, 'traditional' pve mmo released was ff11.
Playerbases are like evolution, its not about creating whats potentially best ts about sticking with what manages to work. WoW attracted a lot of people, so developers copied WoW. Why WoW was popular doesnt matter, it was. It just so happens WoW was popular due to its pre-existing blizzard fanbase and its massive advertising campaign, attracting a bunch of first time mmo players, who wouldnt know better or worse. The game was fun enough and so people played it. I played it for a year even though i saw the problems with it. So long as design is driven by profits this will continue.
There would be no wandering around in a proper game, thats the thing i said would happen with this one with out the correct changes.

Avalons now out. We can examine the next week to determin the games fate. If avalon is too dead then the game really doesnt have any future.
 

Jazices

Astellian
Nov 10, 2019
35
34
18
Except noone is saying the game isn't without issues; we just don't want it to be come another easy mode MMO that hands you full BiS in a weeks time which is what is seems a lot of those that "want the game to be a viable contender in the western market" even though the second they cave to those guys the game will become a failure as everyone maxes out in a week gets bored and leaves.......with those that whined for the change usually being the first to bail.
Can tell somebody didn’t read anything in this topic. It has been said to remove wrong stats you absolutely never ever will need wil int wis knw on melee or if not removing them to add a way to reroll them.
Tickets are mentioned and clear p2w leftover as you can’t even help out anyone with the whole 3-5 dungeons you get a day ruining what makes mmos mmos playing with others and randoms. Neither reducing tickets or adjusting rng will give bis as it is mathematically impossible bis would be triplestat 51 on all 3 never ever gonna happen even if they remove the wrong stat layer or add stat rerolls still not possible. Closing after weeks of farming yes but bis never. that’s all oldschooler can come up with once they know they are in the wrong mimimi bis in a week. Not in any single mmo ever do you get bis in a week not even in the super non rng at all awesomeness ones where people like you would cry that you get gear via farmable tokens with known in advance set in stone stats which you can see before even purchasing.
 

Avator

Astellian
Jun 25, 2019
38
25
18
I would love removing 'wrong stats' but I think some people use them in Korea.
Like evasion on mages....
 
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Lewtz

Astellian
Sep 20, 2019
111
40
28
Ya nothing like rng an entire weeks worth of avalon tokens blowing up for no real reason right just because they wanted to add delete upon fail? So some people will get purple/orange others nothing for the same work?
 

Avator

Astellian
Jun 25, 2019
38
25
18
Ya nothing like rng an entire weeks worth of avalon tokens blowing up for no real reason right just because they wanted to add delete upon fail? So some people will get purple/orange others nothing for the same work?
Yeah. I'm ok with some RNG (dungeon drops, craft) but anything that takes away my hard work (destroyed items, enchantment going DOWN)... that's a deal breaker for me. It's high stakes high gains type of systems good for gambling junkies. I prefer rewarding based on amount of effort type of systems. I loved when Aion had coin type rewards from dailies where.. if you did not get lucky enough to drop gear from dungeon in weeks and weeks, then at least you could buy pieces with tokens awarded from dailies and weeklies. It was a great system. It meant unlucky people who work hard could catch up. It meant casual players could eventually catch up.
Make it you can enchant treasures that can break, okay, but also make it that if you instead farm for 3 weeks you can straight up buy the legendary. I could live with that. Gamblers can try to do it faster, and people who don't like gambling can just be patient and still get it. (albeit slower). It wouldn't take away the "high stakes high gains" but it wouldn't discourage those who simply are never lucky.